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tv   CNN Newsroom  CNN  October 18, 2012 11:00am-12:00pm EDT

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>> our "talkback" question today. from sue "drop it, it must be awful to have your every word scrutinized." >> from sandra, "this needs to be discussed since it's indicative of mitt romney and the republican party's position on women in general." >> this from john, "it's funny. but we are a snarky crowd." cnn continues right now with ashleigh banfield. >> thank you, carol. it's 11:00 on the east coast, 8:00 on the west coast. we begin with a plot to blow up the federal reserve foiled.
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nafis was here in the united states on a student visa and he was studying cyber security. this is not the first time people hell bent on killing us have used us to hone their craft. terrorists from 9/11, we effectly taught them how to pilot their planes. luckily this time the bomb in this suspected deal was a fake, part of an elaborate sting operation by federal authorities. the prosecutors say this person was motivated by al qaeda. ali velshi joins us now to tell us how far the plot got. >> he was recruited in a sting operation. he expressed interest in committing these acts. it turns out he was working on his own.
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he did think he was working with other people. they happened to be informants and fbi sources. he gathered the materials to make the bomb, a thousand pound bomb, got down to new york in the financial district, parked his bomb there and attempted to detonate this bomb. >> not a sophisticated fellow we should add. >> no. while the federal reserve bank is a big deal, it not something most people know. it's not a landmark most new yorkers even know about. it's a highly secure environment. his description in his letter that he wrote was lifted off of wikipedia. it's one. largest reservoirs of gold, got a big vault. >> that bomb probably wouldn't have gotten anywhere near it? >> no. >> and he stopped along the way to videotape -- >> yes. we were talking to our terrorism expert earlier. he said this doesn't have the hall mark of a more
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sophisticated crime. lone wolves often don't. the internal apparently was there. >> lone wolf, yes, but some people might have argued back at 9/11 they were lone wolves, too. they weren't an army, weren't a country. >> this guy ended up working with the fbi without him knowing it but he clearly thought he was going to detonate a bomb or at least that's what the police are alleging. >> i understand this is still very much in its infancy in terms of how much we know and how much we're going to know before trial, if there even is a trial, why did it get so far, understanding that the bomb was a fake, why did they allow this to progress so incredibly far that he was actually out in front? were they trying to collect enough evidence and nail him? >> here's the interesting part about this, i haven't been down to the new york federal reserve bank in years and i happened to be there on monday afternoon to interview the president of the new york federal reserve bank. he replaced tim geithner when
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geithner became the treasury secretary. this is the two of us walking in that building -- it says tuesday but i think it was monday. that's the floor when all those meetings were held to determine which banks are taking over which banks, that's where it all happened. eight secure environment. it's not normally thought of as a target. most people find it hard to find. it's a low-profile organization. when the fed wants to lower or raise interest rates, they do it in that building because that's where they trade with the banks to trade bonds. it's unclear why they let it get that far. i didn't get a sense of heightened security when i was there on monday but it's very secure. i'm not sure how far somebody can get -- or as you know because you're a legal expert, whether they would see how far he would go. >> lots more charges when you actually have your finger on the button hear than just making calls. here we are, raising questions
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about this whole student visa process, studying cyber security. maybe more so are we patrolling those student visas and if we are, are we patrolling the kinds of students that we let in, particularly the ones who are enrolled in such disciplined cyber security and maybe those students coming from specific nations we have our eye on? phillip is the former deputy director in the cia's counterterrorism center. thanks very much for joining us. i want to ask you right off the bat, this particular suspect here on a student visa with the plan to study cyber security, what would the process just be for a guy like this from a country like bangladesh who asks america to let him in to do this kind of study. any different from someone who wants to be an english major? >> i don't think so. if you're looking at the profile of students whether it's from a place like bangladesh or the middle east, they're typically
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coming here for professional agrees so they can have a career in the hard sciences, biology, chemistry, medicine. they're not come hearing to study literature. so to weed out somebody would be next to impossible. >> when they get here, is it too many to patrol or would they be surveilling students like this before they have any probable cause that somebody might be up to no good? >> there's no way to surveil the number of foreign students we have in this country. they number in the hundreds of thousands. you have to wait for somebody to call in and say i have a friend who is talking about committing an act of violence. or you have to wait for this person to make a mistake, as this individual did reaching out in this case to an fbi source. >> what about the potential and this may be a real reach, but is it such a reach to suggest that the government could actually use the student visas as a lure for potential terrorists to actually bring them in to be able to watch them and break into their networks abroad and
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here as well? it's almost like entrapment but the kind of entrapment that starts before the game even begins? >> i don't think any practitioner would do that. you might see that in a movies. you don't allow someone who is a risk into this country and who might pose a risk to human life in a city like new york or chicago. nobody in the business would ever do that. >> what about the idea of potentially being able to change our process prior to 9/11, what we did put into place, has anything been effective, are there still loopholes, still problems, and clearly this arrest tells us there's a problem. how bad is it and how much ground have we made in the student visa area? >> i think there are loopholes in the process but it comes down to the question what we want in this country. with the students we have here, we're creating decades of people who view america who want to have a vacation, do business with america, who speak the language well. if you want to balance that with
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a few cases where a kid goes bad and they're going home and seeing america as a place of atrack for decades, that's a tough balance to make. as it stands, it's not hard to get into the country on a student visa. >> thank you. it's not clear whether the suspect in this case maintained any al qaeda ties. he said it was an inspiration, though, al qaeda was his inspiration. authorities say that this plot was his own. he claims this and the authorities also say this was his own mosole motivation for t united states trip. utting clien. helping generations through tough times. good times. never taking a bailout. there when you need them. helping millions of americans over the centuries. the strength of a global financial leader. the heart of a one-to-one relationship. together for your future.
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at meineke i have options... like oil changes starting at $19.95. my money. my choice. my meineke. to the campaign trail now, fresh off that debate that looked a bit more like a sparring session. presidential candidates are going to mix it up a little bit. they'll be again together tonight but this will be different, folks. chances are this will be more civilized and somewhat light hearted. the republican challenger, mitt romney and president obama will be guests at the alfred e. smith
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center in new york. >> i think it's interesting that the president still doesn't have an agenda for a second term. don't you think that it's time for him to finally put together a vision of what he'd do in the next four years if he were elected. he's got to come up with that this weekend. there's only one debate left on monday. >> in the meantime the president will make two stops before tonight's big dinner in new york. a little later he'll do this with all that cheering, he'll be on the "the daily show" with jon stewart. and later the president will be speaking at a rally in veterans memorial park in manchester, new hampshire. it's his first visit to the granite state since early september. 4 electoral votes there. with the president in new hampshire are, our jessica
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yellin will be joining me. there's been a trend in the last few speeches, i don't know if it's by accident or on purpose. there's a part of the speech "we have al qaeda on the run" part has been missing from some of them. do you have any background information on what's going on there? >> yesterday he stopped saying that. what i can tell you is that i just got off the phone with a white house official who tells me that their assessment that they've decimated al qaeda leadership is unchanged. what they're saying is because of the president's policies, dozens of senior al qaeda leaders have been taken off the battlefield. they're still aware that affiliates are active, but that
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we should not in essence read into these missing few words, a sense that their overall assessment of al qaeda's strength is in any way altered in the wake of libya, in the wake of of the debate or in the wake of the media controversy over what words the president used and how he described the libya event, ashleigh. >> as a terror plot and when it was described as a terror plot. >> as we move forward, just a few more days will be the third and final presidential debate and the topic is exclusively foreign policy, which is why this becomes all the more important to ask about that specific line. that's our biggest foreign policy issue for many people, al qaeda and terror. i was wondering if that was an impetus for the president to tailor this message. >> i think this lab major topic at the debate and both men
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hopefully will get beyond discussing what words are being used and can talk about the substance of policy. the larger question from the romney camp is why did the assessment come out from the administration explaining -- why was the someplace immediately in the aftermath of the libya attack that there was a professional test when there was no protest. i expect romney himself will push hard on that message in the debate and president obama will no doubt come armed to respond to that and then he will also no doubt get into some of his larger efforts to take out al qaeda and make the case that he's been very successful on that front. there's also the unaddressed issue of our troops in afghanistan and that will be a major topic as well that night, ashleigh. >> jessica, the pictures behind you are lovely. i just have to make note that the trees are beautiful this time of year in that area, but that is not the reason that the president would be in new hampshire, to look at the beautiful trees.
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in fact, i'm trying to figure out the real reason. there are only four electoral votes in new hampshire and we are -- but we're under three weeks until election day. why would he take the time to go to a state at this point where he did very well in '08. why go after those four electoral votes now? >> excellent question. it's because they expect it to be such a razor thin margin of victory to either candidate that they are campaigning aggressively for every state they think they can win. and it is a neck-and-neck race right before the debate. the latest poll here showed them tied 47-47. the president is taking his time to court the voters here to get four electoral votes that could make the difference come election day for one man getting into the white house, ashleigh. >> i wish this were your friday so you could take the weekend to enjoy the fall foliage but,
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nope, you'll be right on that plane with him back to new york. thank you for your time. jessica and all of my friends and colleagues are going to be doing this, the final presidential debate is live monday night at 7:00 eastern. the focus is on foreign policy. it should be a barn burner in boca raton. join us live monday night here at 7:00 eastern.
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explosive belts around their waist. hundreds gathered to celebrate his death. des spied wide opposition from the catholic community in ireland, the first ever private clinic to offer abortion services is opening in belfast. until now women looking to have an abortion had to travel to england. one woman 18 living in northern ireland said she would have benefited if she'd had more options. >> i think if i'd been able to access the services sooner, if they were available in northern ireland in keeping in line with the rest of the u.k., it would have made a huge difference. >> in britain in 1967 the abortion act guaranteed women the right to abortions in most cases but that did no include
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you probably know that reporters work pretty hard, especially reporters who are covering presidential campaigns and debates. it is one report after another, one appearance after another and
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they tell two friends and so on and so on. it is tough work. and they go late, folks, and wake up early. so when the debate ends and there is just a wee bit of down time for a guy like paul steinhauser, who i literally beg for a little time every day, he finds a little bit of time to get away from me. he is live with me now to tell me about his down time. we do this thing called the travel insider and find these little great places all over. you found one while you're working. what's the sorry about this place, why did you choose that place? >> it's been around since the 1950s. locals will tell you they remember when they were kids their mom and dads would take them there 30 years ago. it's right down hempstead turnpike, right over the border
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in east meadow, new york. hofstra was the site for years ago of the presidential debate as well. yesterday after we finished working 48 straight hours pretty much, i had a quick lunch there before flying back to d.c. >> that's right, would you have had a chance to remember it from four years ago. did they remember you? >> no. but i remembered their spaghetti and meatballs. i had it four years ago and had it again. >> you didn't take advantage of the free budweiser tent. >> i did that, too, but that's a story for another time. >> off air. i'll see you again probably tomorrow and on monday. thanks, paul. >> you got it. at wells fargo, we believe you can never underestimate
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men booted from the boy
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scouts accused of child sex abuse. in less than two hours, more than a thousand of them are set to be identified. that's because more than 20,000 documents are about to be released by court order. these are confidential files, folks. they've been kept over a 20-year period. they were files kept on the men in this organization who were believed to be preying on young boys. bits and pieces of them you've probably heard about. they've leaked out because of lawsuits since they were uncovered last month, but today a really big chunk of these files are going to be made public for the first time. the attorneys who are suing the scouts say that the secrecy that these files have had in them for so long has allowed thousands of child molesters to roam free and offend again. >> reporter: 18-year-old keith early joined the boy scouts at 12, recruited by nick price miller, a married father of three and volunteer firefighter who led scout meetings in this washington state church.
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>> he was building a boy scout, like a big huge boy scout camp because he had a 42-acre ranch. he asked if i wanted to help him build it. i loved it. it was awesome. like, i don't know, i mean, i didn't think anything bad could happen out there. >> reporter: then came the sexual molestation that has milner prismil miller in prison. >> it felt all alone. how could you do that to somebody? how could you bring yourself to do that to somebody that is so innocent and, you know, has done nothing wrong? >> reporter: in oregon under court order and over the objections of the boy scouts of america, boxes containing 20,000 pages from the boy scouts ineligible volunteer or so-called perversion files are being released to the public. victim kelly clark has spent months redacting the file to
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remove names of victims and witnesses. he says they document the cases of more than 1,200 leaders and volunteers dismissed by the boy scouts, largely for sexual abuse from 1965 through 1985. >> they are sociopathic geniuses. they fool everybody. and then they are able to coerce, convince or threaten these kids to stay silent. and you see that play out over and over again in the files. >> for decades the boy scouts have kept the files' contents e secret, arguing confidential was needed to keep the victims' identity private but in some cases they failed to report abuse to law enforcement. >> we're talking about hundreds if not thousands of unidentified men who should be registered sex offenders, who are roaming free to work in schools and that sort of thing. >> hale, himself a former scout, is one of the attorneys suing to
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unseal all of the files. the efforts to force the boy scouts to open its files is bogged down in this one like courts in this one in ventura, california. the appeals court is examining thousands of cases of alleged abuse by scout leaders since 1991 and is expected to rule soon on the effort to make them public. the boy scouts released a video statement apologizing for sexual abuse and detailing policy changes. >> these include preventing one-on-one contact between an adult and youth member, requiring every scouting activity be open to observation by parents and mandating that suspicions of abuse be reported to the property local authorities and scouting leadership. >> reporter: boy scouts has hired a former police detective to review the files and report abuse to law enforcement. >> it's such a loosely running outfit, i wouldn't feel comfortable letting my kid into
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it. >> it allows the boy scouts of america to claim that boy scouting is safer when there's not an iota of evidence that they've produced to suggest it is any safer than it was during the time period when these files were kept. >> reporter: that evidence, or the lack thereof is likely in the more recent per investigation files the boy scouts of america is still fighting to keep secret. ? you think you're going to slip some fiber by us? okay. ♪ fiber one is gonna make you smile. ♪ [ male announcer ] introducing new fiber one nutty clusters and almonds. anyone have occasional constipation, diarrhea, gas, bloating? yeah. one phillips' colon health probiotic cap each day helps defend against these digestive issues with three strains of good bacteria. approved! [ female announcer ] live the regular life. phillips'.
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i have an incredible moment to show you that happened in marion county, alabama. it's sort of a bad news turned good news story. after a 15-hour search, this little boy, for 15 hours they searched for him, he's 10 years old with down syndrome. they found him in the woods. a little boy like that all anyway long in the woods, very cold, was able to keep himself warm with puppies, two of his puppies helped him through the night. and here they are. word got out that kyle had disappeared from his home on tuesday. our affiliate reports that 150 people, friends and neighbors and police and firemen all came
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together to look for this little guy. they looked all night. and then into the morning. one volunteer followed the family dog to a creek and they found little kyle huddled up with the puppies. he was cold and he was wet but he was okay. they have him now and those puppies are simply fantastic. puppies saved that little guy, that little boy. >> and did you get a chance to see the space shuttle of endeavor rolling through the streets last week? we have something terrific for you. it is the whole shebang on time warps. the ship drawarfing the houses. oh, man!
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when you see all the pictures put together like this and the time lapse, i think it really does tell you just what a remarkable feat of accomplishment this was for los angeles. yes, they did cut down the trees and, yes, they did upset a lot of people. they say they're replanting many more for each one they took down. imagine if you're in traffic waiting for the stop light because that's rolling by? usa! i love it. while on the subject of awesome video, i have something else to show you, the kilauea vol cany in hawaii. the lava lake inside the crater is now at its highest levels since it began. i don't know if someone was manning the camera or how they got so close because that is hot stuff.
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anyway, some nice pictures for you out of hawaii. s to choose from? your ford dealer. who's offering a rebate? your ford dealer. who has the low price tire guarantee... affording peace of mind to anyone who might be in the market for a new set of res? your ford dealer. i'm beginning to sense a pattern. buy four select tires, get a $60 rebate. use the ford service credit credit card, get $60 more. that's up to $120. where did you get that sweater vest? your ford dealer.
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there is perhaps nothing more taxing in life than looking after someone in your family who is sick, and there are millions of us struggling under this burden every day. in fact 65 million of your neighbors are having this problem right now. the baby boomer generation is aging, which means you can expect that number only to go up, people. that's the older generation. how about the kids? let's just take autism alone. it burdens 1 in 88 families with an overwhelming level of care. and there are millions of your neighbors who are finding themselves just burned out trying to do their jobs, look after these kids and adults and sometimes that workload leads them to just give up, quit their jobs and hope for the best. and sometimes that best is not out there. jonathan schwartz face thundershower sufficieed this
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suffocating decision. he was a coe. why making his chase led him to discover to come up with something that could help us all if we find ourselves in this boat. you're a mega ceo and you leave that job because of the situation in your family. what happened to you? what happened to your child and your parent and what did you discover, what did you find that could help us all if we have a similar problem? >> well, first and foremost, i think all of us are very familiar with living life in a digital world, all the information is online. when i had a child who had some health issues about a decade ago, my wife and i were struggling to find out where's a safe place to actually put this information where we can get access to it if we're on the road or provide it to a baby-sitter. i faced the same situation when
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it came time to look after my parents. my parents were older, they were getting frail. where is there a private place where can you store information and make it available to everybody. we all know about the public places that are going to be the subject of privacy inquiries and advertising exposure. that's what led me to create care zone. >> and carezone is a site where someone who finds themselves struggling put all their information and use tools that will help them organize their lives. you give me a feel for what exactly i can get out of care zone. >> well, care zone is basically a private social network. it's where you can put your dad's social security numbers and bank passwords and not worry anyone will get access to them, and their blood type and description how you put them to bed at night so you can give it to a baby-sitter.
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it's private and we're trying to make life easier for parents who are typically caring for children and often their parents as well, a safe place online where can you store information, get access to it and share it where you're entirely in control. you just visit the site and register. >> jonathan, your care zone is a business and it does cost money for people to do this. i want to bring in our medical correspondent, elizabeth cohen, who is brilliant when it comes to empowered patients. this caught my eye, elizabeth, because thinking about what it takes to look after people when you're busy and working and commuting and all the different stresses, there are things like keeping a journal, contact list, even connecting to other people that you might want to do online and there is that fear that this material can get out there. but jonathan's not the only person who has done this. give me an idea of what's out there online and you're in this
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boat and you're vulnerable, what you should be looking for. >> if you're going to be talking about private information, especially things like social security numbers, you want to feel really good about the place where you're putting them down. in contrast, some people, for example, like to communicate on facebook. o oh, my son's not feeling so well today and they want the support of their friends. it depends, first of all, what you're sharing. second of all, this is such a great time for people meeting these challenges because there are so many options out there. there is jonathan schwartz's site, there are several sites out there where you can do lots of different things, where you can arrange medical records, communicate with other people facing the sam challenges you are, where care givers can share information. it's wonderful to have all these options. >> jonathan, a quick question for you. obviously you've got a heck of a
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background because you were ceo of sun microsystems. how can i be sure your site is hack proof and how can i be sure that there isn't someone out there who wants all that data that elizabeth is talking about? >> i think first and foremost you want to read the privacy policy of any site that you have use and actually understand what it says. i think we're all accustomed to being presented with a 50-page privacy policy and told just don't bother reading it. we want you to read ours so you understand how you're protected. secondly, it's important to understand business models. we are an ad-free site. advertising is predicated on we want them to do interesting stuff which makes the user not so much the customer as the product, the advertise certificate customer. you want to understand privacy policy and business model.
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we focus on making care zone ad free. and then you want to understand the individuals involved. that matters. >> jonathan schwartz, thanks for your time today, appreciate it. and elizabeth, cohthank you as always. >> from the medical files, fascinating pictures and a brand new look for a man named richard lee norris. take a peek at him, seven months after a marathon surgery replaced his jaw, his teeth and his tongue to repair damage from a devastating gun accident. we have a comparison to show you. before surgery. remarkable. and then the after surgery, which just tells you how spectacular this operation was. he had to wear a mask at one point to avoid people staring at him and making comments as he was trying to heal. about a week after the face transplant, the transformation was pretty darn good but now
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this surgery has shown a remarkable healing process. this all came after ten years of research at the university of maryland medical center. research that was funded by the office of naval research and the department of defense, an >> an office to hopes to serve veterans that are wounded in action. amazing series of pictures from our medical files to show you today. copies of my acceptance speech. great! it's always good to have a backup plan, in case i get hit by a meteor. wow, your hair looks great. didn't realize they did photoshop here. hey, good call on those mugs. can't let 'em see what you're drinking. you know, i'm glad we're both running a nice, clean race. no need to get nasty. here's your "honk if you had an affair with taylor" yard sign. looks good. [ male announcer ] fedex office. now save 50% on banners.
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his morning starts with arthritis pain. and two pills. afternoon's overhaul starts with more pain. more pills. triple checking hydraulics. the evening brings more pain. so, back to more pills. almost done, when... hang on. stan's doctor recommended aleve. it can keep pain away all day with fewer pills than tylenol. this is rudy. who switched to aleve. and two pills for a day free of pain. ♪ and get the all day pain relief of aleve in liquid gels. >> he was once the titan of
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strength and resillance, but lance armstrong's golden image is melting under an avalanche of doping allegations. many of them from last week's crushing report by the u.s. anti-doping agency. the fallen has been fierce. a spray of sponsors all cutting ties, moving on from lance. one sponsor in particular stands out, nike. nike has been a loyal backer for years, but it's turning its back. nike. this is the same sponsor that stood by kobe bryant and tiger woods during their immense crisis. they are walking away from lance, and they're citing "seemingly insurmountable evidence" that armstrong doped. which is why this makes it all the more painful to show you this television ad that they released in 2001. you may remember it. you may not. it features lance armstrong being drug tested and angrily fighting his critics.
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>> everybody wants to know what i'm on. what am i on? i'm on my bike busting my [ bleep ] six hours a day. what are you on? >> yeah. anyway, armstrong is continuing to deny that ever doped, but this image problem may just be the tip of the iceberg for him because there could be some huge legal problems ahead for him as well. costly legal problems. it seems that nothing is halting his exponential fall from grace. here's brian todd. >> reporter: this was the pinnacle, seven straight tour de france titles between 1999 and 2005 that transcend the cycle and made lance arm strong a global icon. he was unsurpassed as a sports hero, philanthropist, marketing brand. fast forward off a cliff. armstrong, a cancer survivor, just resigned as chairman of his own cancer fighting charity livestrong, saying he wants to spare it any negative effects as
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a result of controversy over his career. nike has dumped him, citing seemingly insurmountable evidence that lance armstrong participated in doping and misled nike. nike is taking his name off its campus fitness center in oregon. anheuser-busch is also severing ties. >> how precipitous is this as a fall from grace? >> you know, this is like falling into the grand canyon without a net. >> michael robinson, a specialist and strategic communications and damage control says armstrong's demise has been building. he says it really started to drop last week. that's when the anti-doping agencies it had uncovered overwhelming evidence that he was involved in a sophisticated doping program while he was active as a cyclist. the agency's report said several teammates of armstrong's testified that he used banned steroids and trying tried to hide it from testing officials. armstrong has consistently denied ever using performance enhancing drugs, but the tide of opinion is undeniable.
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>> you can push marianne jones and barry bonds and roger clemens and rosy ruiz aside, and lance armstrong is the greatest fraud in the history of sports. >> a spokeswoman for livestrong says the charity has had an uptick in donations since august when armstrong stopped challenging the anti-doping agency's probe, but the head of a charity watchdog says even though listrong is a well-run organization, it may take a hit from this later. >> having the head of the group and the founder and the head be somebody that's not trustworthy makes it really hard -- makes it really difficult for a charity. >> robinson says the amount of potential personal earnings armstrong may lose is inclatable. >> if are you advising lance armstrong, what do you tell him to do to recover his reputation personally? >> i think until he is able to right the ship and talk to people candidly about what happened and either present evidence that it didn't happen or demonstrate contradition that i did it and i have made a
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mistake, and i'm prepared to move on, he can't move on. >> people involved in his charity stress that it's important to remember that whatever has happened with the doping allegations and cycling, what lance armstrong has done for cancer patients is still very impressive and that doesn't change. they point out livestrong has raised nearly $500 million for the fight against cancer and helped 2.5 million people. brian todd, cnn, washington. with the bankamericard cash rewards credit card, i earn 1% cash back everywhere, every time. [ both ] 2% back on groceries. [ all ] 3% on gas! no hoops to jump through. i earn more cash back on the things i buy most. [ woman in pet store ] it's as easy as... [ all ] one! -two. -[ all ] three! [ male announcer ] the bankamericard cash rewards credit card. apply online or at a bank of america near you.
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>> it started in may of 2010. it concluded this past february of 2012 with them saying, you know what, hands off, we're not going to move forward. now, that's not the end of it. why isn't it the he wanted of it? because there was no adjudication of finding of guilt, so no double jeopardy applies. they could decide let's reopen it and let's prosecute. he is not out of the woods. that's the criminal side. civilly, remember that $p.5 million settlement in the arbitration because -- >> i should explain this, though. this was for a performance
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bonus -- >> yes. $5 million. >> that he got u.s. postal service. he was the cyclist for the team. the team gave him the bonus, but they asked for an insurance policy. >> smart move. >> for that bonus, and now the insurance company is saying we paid you a lot of money. >> initially they didn't want to pay it out. why? because there were rumors of this type of abuse and drugging. ultimately theshgs decided fight it. they went to arbitration. arbitration is a proceeding where a muteral arbitrator sits in judgment, right, and they settled for $7359 million. the $5 million bonus, ashleigh, plus $2.5 million in legal fees making the lawyers happy. however, they're going to chal tenning now. why? because they're saying it was predicated upon fraud. if we knew now what we knew then, we would have never settled. that's the civil monetary aspect of it. >> the whole perjury issue brings into whether he will be facing jail. >> these affidavits, it's horrible. >> it's not good. i'm going to get you back so we can talk about this more in depth because we're just flat out of time, but there's a big long conversation to be had. >>

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